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Mike Temporale
Managing Editor
Joined: 07 Jul 2003
Posts: 8577
Location: Toronto, Canada
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 Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 8:45 am Post subject: The Future of the Smartphone Through The Eyes Of Sony Ericss |
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http://www.business2.com/b2/web/art...00.html?cnn=yes
Business 2.0 has posted a very interesting interview with Urban Gillstrom, president of Sony Ericsson. They cover a lot of information about how Sony Ericsson turned the boat around and was able to report 5 consecutive profitable quarters. Here's what Urban had to say about looking at other operating systems for future devices.
"No, we're fully focused on Symbian. As an operating system, Symbian is really the only one designed for smartphones. It offers great communication for both voice and data, and that's something the other operating systems don't always do a great job with. I can't speak about future products, but we think that is the ultimate operating system for smartphones. In the United States, there are Windows- and Palm-based phones, but you don't see that as much overseas."
That's too bad. I would really like to see a Sony Ericsson based Windows Mobile device. Since he won't comment on future devices, I guess all hope is not lost. What are your thoughts?
Source: Santa Fe
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"I have no special talents, I am only passionately curious" - Albert Einstein
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possmann
Smartphone Thinker
Joined: 07 Jul 2003
Posts: 473
Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin, USA
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| Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 9:35 am Post subject: |
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You know I'm not surprised (dissapointed, but not surprised)... Sony has always moved to the beat of their own drum thinking that everyone else will follow - look at their memory stick thing - in my opinion that flopped.
Sigh - It would be nice to see Sony in the mix as I do like the quality of their hardware... but I'm not holding my breath for that at all...
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nikjones
Smartphone Pupil
Joined: 16 Sep 2004
Posts: 29
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| Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 3:34 pm Post subject: |
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It was a SE P800 that convinced me that I didn't want a touchscreen phone, so I sold it and went for a C500 and am thoroughly happy with it. My main needs are PIM, which (with Power Tasks) are handled perfectly without a touchscreen, and I can carry it anywhere. A toughscreen phone requires a case, so is too bulky. The Symbian OS was good, though; when my J720 packs in I may get the 9500-type communicator.
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Phoenix
Smartphone Pupil
Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 33
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| Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 4:05 pm Post subject: |
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More Sony stubborness.  What else is new?
Symbian truly stinks, IMO. It's NOT the best choice for smartphones. I own an SE P900, and although it has some neat features, and although it's better than some devices out there, I will absolutely be upgrading to a Windows Mobile Phone Edition device like the Moto MPx or an iMate PDA2k. Those two phones will put a P900 to shame.
Symbian has too many shortcomings and limitations - maybe they should ultimately dub those Symbian-powered devices Dumbphones because of it. Windows Mobile is FAR more flexible and powerful an OS and is/will be the obvious choice for any discriminating smartphone user.
Sony has always putted right along stupidly without truly assessing what people like or don't like - I guess they enjoy shoving their technologies down peoples' throats:
1) Memory Stick - which is no more than tolerable, but do any of us REALLY like this memory format? I don't think so.
2) ATRAC? Please.
3) Symbian. Too far behind Windows Mobile, illogical and unintuitive.
As more Windows Mobile powered phones are arriving on the scene, they are becoming more and more the obvious choice over Symbian. Windows Mobile is becoming more powerful, more flexible, more stable, and better hardware is coming out to run it.
Moto will release the MPx. iMate has released the PDA2k. PalmOne will be releasing a WM-based Treo it sounds like, now. Not to mention other WM powered smartphones like the Moto MPx 220 and so on are on the scene.
What phones running Symbian have been released that are so great? Few to none, IMO.
And think of all the software that is available for WM powered devices. This alone puts Symbian to shame!
As WM, and its hardware and software keep blazing along, I sense they're forcing Symbian into the shadows more and more. Symbian based phones simply are not taking the spotlight anymore like they used to.
Windows Mobile is truly the leader now.
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aristoBrat
Smartphone Thinker
Joined: 16 Oct 2003
Posts: 415
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| Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 8:07 pm Post subject: Re: The Future of the Smartphone Through The Eyes Of Sony Er |
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| Quote: |
| In the United States, there are Windows- and Palm-based phones, but you don't see that as much overseas." |
Que? Qui? Donde?
Isn't Windows Mobile's biggest footprint overseas (Europe) currently?
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Mike Temporale
Managing Editor
Joined: 07 Jul 2003
Posts: 8577
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Tue Nov 02, 2004 8:29 pm Post subject: Re: The Future of the Smartphone Through The Eyes Of Sony Er |
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| aristoBrat wrote: |
| Quote: |
| In the United States, there are Windows- and Palm-based phones, but you don't see that as much overseas." |
Que? Qui? Donde?
Isn't Windows Mobile's biggest footprint overseas (Europe) currently?
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That's what I thought. If it's not the biggest, it's at least a sizable footprint. But I couldn't find anything to back that up with, so....
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"I have no special talents, I am only passionately curious" - Albert Einstein
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TANKERx
Smartphone Intellectual
Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Posts: 169
Location: South Wales
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| Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 5:33 am Post subject: |
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Phoenix, you're making a lot of statements which don't hold water. Particularly when you say that WM Software titles put Symbian ones to shame. Which ones would these be?
Symbian had a MiniGPS (based on cell ID) before the first Microsoft Smartphone was released. Symbian has software titles which act as motion detectors and will send an image (via e-mail or MMS) if something moves or makes a sound. Where is the WM equivalent? Most cross-platform mobile games are released first on Symbian. Symbian Smartphones (Series60) have software to view and edit Word, Excel and Powerpoint documents. Where is your equivalent to that? This is just the tip of the iceberg. Push To Talk? The innovations that are being made on the Symbian platform are far higher and wider than you are stating.
I'm not saying that WM is lousy - I'm still using my MPx200 and it's going Ok (even though it's bee ruined by a dodgy ROM image - but that's my fault). What I am saying is that you can't write off a mobile OS when it is proving that it is flexible and reliable.
In what way do you say it's not flexible? How do you say it's not intuitive (I laughed when I saw the sneak preview / screenshots of the latest Smartphone software on various enthusiast sites because they looked a lot like the Symbian Series60 applications menu)?
So come on, pull yourself together and be happy.
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refnulf
Smartphone Pupil
Joined: 28 May 2004
Posts: 43
Location: Malaysia
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| Posted: Wed Nov 03, 2004 6:59 pm Post subject: |
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Yep, I wouldn't go about dissin the symbian platform. It's pretty decent.
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Phoenix
Smartphone Pupil
Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 33
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| Posted: Thu Nov 04, 2004 5:46 am Post subject: |
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| TANKERx wrote: |
| Phoenix, you're making a lot of statements which don't hold water. Particularly when you say that WM Software titles put Symbian ones to shame. Which ones would these be? |
What I'm referring to when I say that, is the sheer number of great titles (not just junk) available for Windows Mobile (WM) devices in comparison to what I see available for Symbian devices. There's a fair amount these days for just about any OS, and I’m not suggesting that there isn’t any good software for Symbian (some good apps are made for both OS’s), but WM overall clearly dominates in terms of well written software. There is just more support on the Microsoft side of things. I couldn't possibly provide a laundry list of everything. You just have to look around to see what I'm talking about. Start with Handango online.
Keep in mind, I’m not just referring to WM Smartphone (WM-S) OS. I’m also largely referring to the Windows Mobile Phone Edition (WM-PE) OS which will run any Pocket PC software, so you have to keep that in mind as you read. I'm first thinking of the most powerful of the devices on both sides out there - devices with touchscreens, etc. running WM-PE, then WM-S phones.
Now as far as the WM Smartphone (WM-S) OS is concerned, although Symbian has been more popular an OS over the years while WM-S has existed (not because it’s better, but because Symbian existed first), WM-S is growing and although there may be exceptions, it seems to me that the software being developed for it shares the same mark of excellence that I see in software written for WM-PE (which once again, is the same software developed for Pocket PC’s) – it’s just of better quality overall - better designed, more attractive, more powerful, and there seems to certainly be a better variety of good titles.
And although Symbian is not responsible for the hardware side of things per se, my opinion was also based on the phone hardware coming to market that’s running each OS - so keep that in mind as well. I’m not suggesting that no interesting Symbian phones have been made (I’ve owned an SE P800 and own a P900, myself), but lately, IMO, devices running WM (and some soon to be released), and more specifically WM-PE, are offering nicer designs, are a bit richer in features, and certainly more powerful than the higher-end phones being put out running Symbian.
| TANKERx wrote: |
| Symbian had a MiniGPS (based on cell ID) before the first Microsoft Smartphone was released. Symbian has software titles which act as motion detectors and will send an image (via e-mail or MMS) if something moves or makes a sound. Where is the WM equivalent? |
Why care about who had what first? What matters is what's available currently. And forget cell ID-based GPS, which isn't much of anything. Try full GPS. I know that there have been attempts at writing GPS mapping software for Symbian, but I can't find anything that even comes close to what is available for WM. If you're looking to run really well-rounded, powerful GPS mapping software, complete with 3D maps and voice prompts, WM is the only way to go. There just isn't remotely the same variety and support for GPS software on the Symbian side of things as there is on the WM side of things.
And as far as motion detection software that will message your phone is concerned, here is a WM equivalent: www.fgeng.com. And that's just one example. You can find other examples on Handango and elsewhere for just about all the main OS's in regards to this.
But you've only mentioned a couple of things here. And I easily countered them with examples of my own. There are many things that can be done with WM-PE that can't be done at all with Symbian. I've seen many examples of various hardware and software in medicine, IT, imaging, graphics, and business industries, that will run on WM-PE, but not Symbian. I wish I had the time to provide several specific examples to really illustrate what I’m saying, but they do exist. In medicine, for example, I don't see nearly the quality or capability in software on the Symbian side that I see on the WM side.
| TANKERx wrote: |
| Most cross-platform mobile games are released first on Symbian. |
What makes you think that? I myself couldn’t say for sure one way or another in regard to that. But then, I don’t know if you’re thinking about WM-S only, or games made for WM in general (which would also include games that run on Pocket PC’s and therefore WM-PE). But even if that is the case, to me, that's neither here nor there, especially if they are finally written for WM, because I do know that there is a huge gaming community out there for WM. Developers have seen what a great platform WM is for games. There are many games out there, and many of the best games I've ever seen (graphics-wise) run on WM. Here's an example: Atlantis Redux
| TANKERx wrote: |
| Symbian Smartphones (Series60) have software to view and edit Word, Excel and Powerpoint documents. Where is your equivalent to that? |
You've gotta be kidding me! Symbian can't even touch WM when it comes to this. You will never find the quality of software for this sort of thing for Symbian that you will find on WM. Have you heard of TextMaker? PlanMaker? Pocket Slides? Nothing on the Symbian side even comes close. Between the two OS's, WM rules the productivity side of things with both hands tied behind its back.
| TANKERx wrote: |
| This is just the tip of the iceberg. Push To Talk? |
Well, quite frankly, let’s forget the tip – it doesn’t seem like much of an iceberg to begin with. Now PTT, I can understand. I can't say there are many WM devices with that. Maybe one or maybe none that I specifically know of (maybe someone else can shed more light on this). However, hopefully that will change. But I don't see that in too many phones, period, regardless of their OS. I think it's a worthwhile feature, it just doesn't seem to be a very popular feature.
| TANKERx wrote: |
| The innovations that are being made on the Symbian platform are far higher and wider than you are stating. |
See, to me, I just don’t see what you're referring to when you say that. And what I mean by that is, I don’t see the innovations you’re speaking of as better offerings than what WM is providing. Again, I’m not saying Symbian doesn’t offer anything, but it just can’t hold a candle to WM and Microsoft. WM, IMO, is really starting to take the spotlight more with more WM-PE devices coming out, and I think as more of these phones continue to arrive on the scene, WM will win the majority loyalty of consumers and the enterprise, over Symbian. Because of all WM devices, WM is shifting gears and continuing to prove itself more and more as the best investment.
| TANKERx wrote: |
| I'm not saying that WM is lousy - I'm still using my MPx200 and it's going Ok (even though it's bee ruined by a dodgy ROM image - but that's my fault). What I am saying is that you can't write off a mobile OS when it is proving that it is flexible and reliable. |
You and I are certainly and obviously on two ends of the spectrum. Regardless of its level of reliability, I can write off Symbian, and I do. I’m just done with it. There just isn’t enough good software out there for it, and the WM OS is just better written and organized, IMO. WM-PE makes too much sense for the reasons I’ve provided for me to invest/waste any more time and effort with Symbian.
| TANKERx wrote: |
| In what way do you say it's not flexible? How do you say it's not intuitive (I laughed when I saw the sneak preview / screenshots of the latest Smartphone software on various enthusiast sites because they looked a lot like the Symbian Series60 applications menu)? |
I’m thinking more of WM-PE in regard to this. Once again, the WM-PE OS, is a Pocket PC with phone capability. So those phones will run anything a Pocket PC will and more. You can do so much more with a WM-PE device than you can a high-end Symbian phone like the P900 (or P910). Again, we’re talking about software and hardware. In this way, Symbian is just not as flexible. The WM-PE OS is just a better organized and logical OS. In this way, Symbian is less intuitive.
But even WM-S makes more sense to me than Symbian.
| TANKERx wrote: |
| So come on, pull yourself together and be happy. |
Is that a stolen lyric? 
Last edited by Phoenix on Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:03 am; edited 2 times in total
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TANKERx
Smartphone Intellectual
Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Posts: 169
Location: South Wales
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| Posted: Fri Nov 05, 2004 5:26 pm Post subject: |
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Inasmuch as you are talking about PocketPC-PE, I agree that you have a point since it has the whole PocketPC legacy behind it.
I thought that you were talking purely about Smartphones (IE, single-handed use which normal people (ie, not geeks) use, which is why I mentioned editing Office documents - you can't do that on a Windows Smartphone - yet - and there have been plenty of requests for it on the forums (or should that be fori?))
There is no comparison between a Series60 Smartphone and a PocketPC because anybody who has bought one will have no need for the other.
In terms of Smartphones, I believe you are correct, you and I are on opposite ends of the spectrum and I will therefore not take personally your rather rude remarks.
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